Artificial. Intelligence.

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Re: Artificial. Intelligence.

Post  Pyrospastiac on Sat Feb 07, 2009 6:56 pm

that looks really cool.

but i'm really not sure about the F-35. because even though i really like it and want to see it in the mod, the reason it's being made is to replace most of our favorites.
in Naval mode, the F-35B is meant to replace the AV-8B.
in ground support, it's meant to replace the A-10
also in Naval mode, it's set to replace the F/A-18
the F-16 is also on the list for replacement
leaving only the f-22 as the not yet obsolete plane that the f-35 wont replace.
pretty much all modern combat games include either the A-10, F/A-18, AV-8B and F-16, or the F-35, but not both. even though i really want to see all of them in the mod, they're just not meant to share the battlefield. meaning that a convincing explanation for storyline reasons is gonna be pretty hard to come up with explaining why all these aircraft are being used along side the F-35.
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Re: Artificial. Intelligence.

Post  Snake on Sat Feb 07, 2009 7:58 pm

Pyrospastiac wrote:that looks really cool.

Thanks Cool

Pyrospastiac wrote:but i'm really not sure about the F-35. because even though i really like it and want to see it in the mod, the reason it's being made is to replace most of our favorites.
in Naval mode, the F-35B is meant to replace the AV-8B.
in ground support, it's meant to replace the A-10
also in Naval mode, it's set to replace the F/A-18
the F-16 is also on the list for replacement

The F-35 is quite an interesting aircraft which will supposedly solve one of the main problems and "niche" in most current air forces: interchangeability.

This plane was made so it can do all kinds of roles and accept a gigantic amount of weaponry to do the current main combat roles: multirole, close air support, tactical bombing, strike missions and air superiority.

That can be seen on it's fantastic weapon compatibility:




Pyrospastiac wrote:leaving only the f-22 as the not yet obsolete plane that the f-35 wont replace.
pretty much all modern combat games include either the A-10, F/A-18, AV-8B and F-16, or the F-35, but not both. even though i really want to see all of them in the mod, they're just not meant to share the battlefield. meaning that a convincing explanation for storyline reasons is gonna be pretty hard to come up with explaining why all these aircraft are being used along side the F-35.

Since The Art of War is placed on the near future (2012) all of those aforementioned aircraft will still be used (and will be used for many years to come), though the F-35 is quite interesting, it won't be able to replace the A-10 right away (the A-10 is considered by many to be the most important western combat aircraft in Iraq right now).

The A-10 with it's massive payload and cannon will make it be used on the battlefield until at least 2030 while the F-35 couldn't ever perform such extensive CAS missions (the fact that it does not posses the same payload, slower speed, cannon or the simple uniqueness of the A-10 since it was built exactly for that specific role).

I used the A-10 as an example since the US Air Force will need decades to replace so many F-15, F-16, A-10's and the US Navy and USMC will use the F/A-18E and F for many decades to come (a perfect example is the brand new EA-18G Growler electronic warfare aircraft which will most likely enter service this or next year).

At first, the F-35 will replace older aircraft in service (the "most vital" replacements so to speak), for example, in the US Navy and USMC cases they will replace:

- F/A-18 Hornets;
- AV-8B Harrier II's (older, non upgraded versions while the AV-8B Plus will remain for a some years).

... as their top priority while perfectly combat-capable aircraft such as Super Hornets will still remain for many years even after the F-35 enter service.

Pyrospastiac wrote:pretty much all modern combat games include either the A-10, F/A-18, AV-8B and F-16, or the F-35, but not both. even though i really want to see all of them in the mod, they're just not meant to share the battlefield. meaning that a convincing explanation for storyline reasons is gonna be pretty hard to come up with explaining why all these aircraft are being used along side the F-35.

The fact that some games include the F-35 as a main aircraft is to give the player the illusion that the game is more "advanced", which is not the case in real life due to simple logistical questions. The US and other Allied Nations will need decades to fully incorporate the F-35 or a huge "vacuum" would happen and the US wouldn't have enough combat ready aircraft (by it's standards). That being said, a game which happens in the near future which does not include the F-35 alongside other "classic" aircraft is highly inaccurate.

The fact is that the F-35 will do many missions alongside everyone's favorite classics (in fact I would go as far as saying that F-16 and F/A-18 pilots will be the ones to show the young F-35 pilots how "it's done" at first).

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Re: Artificial. Intelligence.

Post  Specter on Fri Feb 27, 2009 4:58 am

Tusker2Zero wrote:
James100 wrote:BTW Guys
As we all know that TAOW is a tactical and realistic mod...
But The AI Difficulty We Need To Make It Seam Fair
I Mean Some User's Wont Be Used To Realism
So:

_Dumb AI (Very Easy)
_Smart AI (Medium)
_Genius AI (Brutal)

What DO Ya Think?

_Genius AI (Brutal) = u r mode.

Sorry, I just couldn't resist folks. Twisted Evil

I think the AI should stick the same.
But the Medium and Hard should be improved.

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Re: Artificial. Intelligence.

Post  Marc15yo [Admin] on Fri Feb 27, 2009 9:08 am

trust me man, we got this covered already, if i could only find a quote from the taowtop secret document, i'd post it right here. in summary: the ai will be completely re-birthed. No more sending in waves. the ai will decide it's actions based on what you are doing. no more waves of enemy trying to attack your base. there won't be a base anymore. each map will have an objective. it's not about eliminating your units but focusing on the task at hand, capturing a specific area on a map... and that's what will matter. the easy ai will try to limit it's use of heavy weapons and vehicles, including air units. but will also try a different approach on things too, maybe using more infantry and being more focused on getting the objective done asap instead of putting up a big fight with heavy weapons. while the hard ai will have access to much heavier units, and will try everything in it's power to capture the area AND blow the crap out of your units to try and capture your command flag. and obviously medium will be in between those 2 terms.
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Re: Artificial. Intelligence.

Post  James100 on Fri Feb 27, 2009 11:49 am

Nice Way To Put It Out! sunny
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Re: Artificial. Intelligence.

Post  Pyrospastiac on Sun Mar 01, 2009 3:39 am

very much so. but im not too sure about the whole easy AI thing. some other mods make easy AI leave some units out to make it easier and it really doesn't work well. No but the difference is, their units only go skin deep in terms of variables including just power, speed, and health. seeing as TAOW goes much deeper, i think it'd work better if the easy AI still used every unit but just didnt either a) fully utilize their potential. b) really sucked at using their abilities and functions. or c) making crap decisions with each unit (ie. seeing one of your units on the map and ordering the wrong choice of unit to combat it. as an example of USA Vs USA. when the AI sees you have an abrams, the HARD AI calls in an A-10 to combat it. but when the EASY AI sees it, it calls in a stryker MGS)

-pyro
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Re: Artificial. Intelligence.

Post  Jarhead on Sun Mar 01, 2009 7:36 am

Interesting point Pyro, I can't imagine what the programing looks like?! But if the example above is the case, with the airstrike and all, that really would be best. I will go ahead and speak the first turd and say, it better, or I will stomp it's sorry @$$ back to the comador 64.
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Re: Artificial. Intelligence.

Post  Snake on Mon Mar 23, 2009 3:11 pm

Pyrospastiac wrote:very much so. but im not too sure about the whole easy AI thing. some other mods make easy AI leave some units out to make it easier and it really doesn't work well. No but the difference is, their units only go skin deep in terms of variables including just power, speed, and health. seeing as TAOW goes much deeper, i think it'd work better if the easy AI still used every unit but just didnt either a) fully utilize their potential. b) really sucked at using their abilities and functions. or c) making crap decisions with each unit (ie. seeing one of your units on the map and ordering the wrong choice of unit to combat it. as an example of USA Vs USA. when the AI sees you have an abrams, the HARD AI calls in an A-10 to combat it. but when the EASY AI sees it, it calls in a stryker MGS)

-pyro

Definitely, I'd say that the mod's easy AI is gonna be sort of a mix between those three options (and by throwing in randomization things will tend to truly change instead of the old formula-based ZH battles).

A noticeable difference is that a tougher AI will strike much more aggressively and swiftly (a tougher AI won't hold back on the big guns and support), while the easier AI will be more "delicate" yet unpredictable and prone to give players some "surprises".

In my opinion, keeping the arsenal away from a certain AI isn't the correct answer (that severely makes the battle predictable since we already know what are the possible vehicles the AI can access and use), the fun part is to watch the AI using unexpected strategies and units.

One of the most important points is to make the AI levels accessible and to make them accurately respond to their respective and chosen level (an Easy AI being a more accessible challenge for the casual player while the Hard AI is a merciless badass which holds no punches ).

Jarhead wrote:Interesting point Pyro, I can't imagine what the programing looks like?! But if the example above is the case, with the airstrike and all, that really would be best. I will go ahead and speak the first turd and say, it better, or I will stomp it's sorry @$$ back to the comador 64.

lol!

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