Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  Snake on Wed Nov 05, 2008 6:31 pm

Yup, if a company uses a designation already registered by another company, then they can expect a real "lawyer assault" and a court case.

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fun with airstrikes

Post  Pyrospastiac on Thu Nov 06, 2008 4:19 am

hey guys, i had this thought that jumped out at me a couple of days ago for the mod. i never liked the airstrike system in ZH because it was just a bunch of stuff on the right tab, that you clicked on, and obliterated the area, giving all and any targets with the ability to move, plenty of time to get out of the way, leaving only buildings for attack.

what i was thinking, was to give the infantry squads close air support options that vary depending on what type of squad (precision attacks, tank busters, combat air patrol). these strike icons could go in the squads command hud, instead of the generals powers bar. but instead of painting an area by slapping a big target on the ground, you could actually 'paint' moving targets such as tanks and squads, with the use of laser designators

when the strike arrives instead of blowing the crap out of one spot, it could fire more precise attacks againsed individual targets in the area (so if the tank has friends, they're screwed too). if it's too hard to paint a moving target you can still paint an area, but instead of being a small area that the bombs fall in the center of and completley obliterate with mass overkill, it can be a bigger area that only afew bombs get dropped on targets in the area.

i know that this would take and incredibly long time to code and would make the infantry very powerful. but as you guys said, you didn't want infantry to be pushover meat-shields and mine-testers. this is also realistic as this is the kind of power modern day foot soldiers have at there fingertips. it could be balanced with a biiiig cooldown, or, one-time use.

just throwin it out there as it came to me, pyro.
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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  Marc15yo [Admin] on Thu Nov 06, 2008 7:22 am

yeah, we've already had this idea for a while. infantry squads can call in for artillery support. it also depends for a while.

i was thinking the close air support should be left for vehicles. if infantry squads could call in CAS it would be make infantry a little too powerful.
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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  Pyrospastiac on Fri Nov 07, 2008 4:20 am

to stop squad spamming (without the use of a cap introduction *holds down puke*) to get heaps of CAS at once, the squads of the same type could have a conjoined strike (which would make sense becease each squad can't have there very own plane permenantly allocated to them scratch )

this would mean that when one squad calls in the support, the option is put on cooldown for all squads of the same type, (this would also avoid the requirement for a massive cooldown, and it can be made just sensibly long)

i really would like to see some properly functional methods of CAS in your mod and im sure there are even more ways to bring down the overkill so that infantry aren't total ownage.

hope to get some feedback soon, pyro. 8)
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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  Marc15yo [Admin] on Fri Nov 07, 2008 7:24 am

yeah, were doing the same thing with artillery. it has a shared cool down time b4 it can be re-used.

Close Air support strikes will need to be created realistically. there will be different ammunitions to chose from as well
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idea

Post  guppy19 on Fri Nov 07, 2008 9:28 am

an aircraft carrier

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amazing idea

Post  guppy19 on Fri Nov 07, 2008 9:33 am

a hercules transport that is player controllable, uu know like in contra, u can parachute hummvees and crusader tanks ou tof the hercules, arm the hercules with aa turrents so it can shoot back at the enemy planes, another idea a flak gun, one last idea arm every bomber,transport, or any other transport computer or player controlled with AA guns

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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  Snake on Fri Nov 07, 2008 1:34 pm

Pyrospastiac wrote:to stop squad spamming (without the use of a cap introduction *holds down puke*) to get heaps of CAS at once, the squads of the same type could have a conjoined strike (which would make sense becease each squad can't have there very own plane permenantly allocated to them scratch )

this would mean that when one squad calls in the support, the option is put on cooldown for all squads of the same type, (this would also avoid the requirement for a massive cooldown, and it can be made just sensibly long)

i really would like to see some properly functional methods of CAS in your mod and im sure there are even more ways to bring down the overkill so that infantry aren't total ownage.

hope to get some feedback soon, pyro. 8)

Yup, we want to do it with squad called support like artillery (the 'cooldown' mode).

guppy19 wrote:an aircraft carrier

Yeah 8) , and these are just to show the basic structure of the Naval Mode, because this is just the tip of the iceberg Twisted Evil Smile

guppy19 wrote:a hercules transport that is player controllable, uu know like in contra, u can parachute hummvees and crusader tanks ou tof the hercules, arm the hercules with aa turrents so it can shoot back at the enemy planes, another idea a flak gun, one last idea arm every bomber,transport, or any other transport computer or player controlled with AA guns

We'll have several transports for several tasks (Blackhawks for small infantry squads / C-130J Super Hercules for medium vehicle and large paratrooper drops / C17A Globemaster for dropping heavy vehicles).

All vehicles will be brought in this way, we will remove the base system altogether, also some special vehicles will call in support on the battlefield (the "Barracks" / "Warfactory" / "Airfield" so to speak), those are the 'Command Vehicles', there will be various per different tasks (calling Air Support / calling in infantry, etc.)



For heavy gunship support there will be the AC-130U Spooky fixed wing gunship (for the US side).



To enhance the Mobile AA vehicles / Fighter Jets / AA-armed infantry's roles we will limit Anti-Air weapons to specific classes.

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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  Pyrospastiac on Fri Nov 07, 2008 6:13 pm

when bringing in units to the battlefield, its up to you guys whether infantry pile out of a blackhawk after it touches down or fast-rope out while it hovers over an area. and that smaller vehicles like humvees would be droped out of the back of c130s with big parachutes attached.

but for lager vehicles such as tanks, even though a tank drop is possible and does currently exist, it's not that common in the battlefield to have tanks parachute from the sky. instead, to give more variety to vehicle call-in's, the c17 globemaster should land at a captured airstrip and unload the tanks. or if this takes to long, it could swoop over the runway and drop the tank out the back on a metal plate similar to the one the humvee comes doen on, except with a horizontal parachute to pull it out the back of the plane.
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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  Snake on Sat Nov 08, 2008 3:07 pm

Yeah, actually we want to use Blackhawks to drop both infantry (which will automatically disperse upon a fast rope descent to avoid clogging) and certain light vehicles.

Check these older pics, this is one of several Humvee insertion methods (via C-130):





We may also include several other alternative deployment methods (alternatives to the standard air deployment) such methods are chosen by the player upon vehicle purchase (for example: deploy a Humvee from a Blackhawk or C-130, etc.)

The standard Main Battle Tank/Heavy Vehicle deployment is similar to a mixture of Joint Task Force / World in Conflict.







However we will throw in our own customized modifications (top secret at the moment Suspect Razz ).

There will be some airstrips which will be extremely important for capture, one of those is the airstrip on naval games (usually located on an island / amphibious location) in which C-17's will drop ASM launchers (Mobile Anti-Ship Missile Launchers) on a certain time basis (think of it as a modified "Reinforcement Pad", but much more realistic and way sexier Laughing 8) ).

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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  Pyrospastiac on Wed Nov 12, 2008 12:06 am

that's good to hear because it's more realistic that way. but does it also mean that because airfields cannot be built (thank you! afro ) but must be captured, that tanks and other heavier vehicles can only be brought in later in-game? and that maps with only one airfield will mean that who ever holds the only airfield would have significant power over the other and would not be likely to lose the airfield no matter how well the opposing assault is coordinated due to serious inferiority on their side?
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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  Marc15yo [Admin] on Wed Nov 12, 2008 7:27 am

the airfield will only be used to gain complete airpower. it will elt a oplayer fully manage his aircrafts.

for heavier vehicles, it's a different story. the vehicles will be airdropped. (the heavy ones like mbt's by c-17's). each vehicle must be "purchased" using the ground command vehicle. for certain heavy vehicles we are going to make specific requirements before the player can get his hands on them.
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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  Snake on Wed Nov 12, 2008 3:09 pm

Vehicles such as the M1A2 Abrams tank won't be available for use right away.
Players will need to "earn" access to higher technology/more powerful units.

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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  Pyrospastiac on Sat Nov 15, 2008 10:42 pm

but if airfields are only going to be used for player controlled aircraft rather than vehicle drops, that works for vehicles that are paradroped down from high up, but heavier vehicles like the m1a2 would need a lot of space if you intend to deploy them like in joint task force with the low altitude swoop and dropping them out the back of the plane
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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  James100 on Sun Nov 16, 2008 11:30 am

first off great mod
second hope you like my ideas coz itz gonna be long (im a military FREAK!!!!!)

US: aircraft:
1- a10 thunderbolt
2-tactical bombers : b52 , b1b, b2
3-e3 sentry AWACS
4-can you include electronic warfare LIKE maybe ef111 etc....
5-f22 , f18,f35
6- Rah-66 as covert ops

Russia: aircraft:
1-su-37 terminator , su-47 berkut, su 39 frogfoot
2-tu-160 , tu 22 ,tu95
3-mi-28n havoc , mi26 halo
4-ka60 trans, ka52 alligator
5-an-32
6-mig-31

EU: aircraft:
1-rafale M
2-tornado , ef2000
3-typhoon
4-euro tiger,w3w sokol , nh90

USA: Land Systems:
1-HTTV , Humvee Variants including avenger, microwave It exists etc....
2-LAV25 variants
3-m1 grizzly dozer
4-m167 vulcan, m777 Howitzer
5-m-109a6 paladin ,m270 MLRS
6-m939a2 supply truck

russia: land systems:
1-2C19 MSTA-C , MSTA-b, 2s1 gvozdika
2-T-84 Oplot
3-m256 tunguska
4-gaz-2330 and UAZ pickup
5-bdrm variants
3-bmp1,bmp2,bmp3
4-btr-80 and 90
5-bm21 TOS-1 buratino
6-p35 radar
7-sa-5,sa-6,sa-11,sa13,s300/400 Grumble
8-at4 fagot
9-zsu-23-4 shilka , zu23, Ural375 Suplly truck

EU: land systems:
1-fh-70 howitzer
2-dingo 2
3- geparda2 AA
4-leopard a2
5-lecrec tank
6-roland 2a5
7-PZH2000
8-mercedes Wolf

USA:seacraft
1-CG-47 cruiser
2-lhd-4 Boxer

USA-personnel weapons:
1-browning
2-m4a1 , m16a4
3-m21 sniper, m24 heavy sniper
4-m240d m240g
5-xm8 , m249 saw
6-m224 mortar
7-binoculars , m9berreta and glok 45
8-benneli m4 super
9-xm-109 anti material , xm312
10-socom, mp5, stinger, SMAW And LAW and M3 And AT4

russia: Personnel Weapons
1-ak-74m3 , aks-74u ,rpk74, ak-74 bayonet
2-expiditionary knife, AS val, kord , pecheneg
3-RPG-7v, Rpg-18 ,rpg-22
4-sv-98, ags17, NTW-20,toz-194 , vintorez
5-pp2000,groza,an-94,svd,vepr,fort12,PyA,binoculars,RGD5 RDG2
6-sa-7

EU: personnel weapons:
1-Binoculars
2-dm61 Frag/smoke
3-dsr1
4-fim92 stinger(german version)
5-g36
6-g82 , MSG-90
7-kampfmesser 2000,mg3 , mp2a1 Uzi, Mp7, p8
8-Panzerfaust 3

that is all
good luck
and good work
sincerely JAMES.
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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  Snake on Sun Nov 16, 2008 3:14 pm

Pyrospastiac wrote:but if airfields are only going to be used for player controlled aircraft rather than vehicle drops, that works for vehicles that are paradroped down from high up, but heavier vehicles like the m1a2 would need a lot of space if you intend to deploy them like in joint task force with the low altitude swoop and dropping them out the back of the plane

Yeah, but we are creating some "specials" which will solve that issue and able all players to deploy heavy support without the need of such airstrips, however we haven't discarded that airstrip option yet (we were going to use that system in the early TAOW stages), it will really depend on how the coding goes.

Also we might create diverse airstrips as a part of the new "tactical location" concept I mentioned earlier (such airstrips would have special tasks, other than deploying ASM's).


James100 wrote:first off great mod
second hope you like my ideas coz itz gonna be long (im a military FREAK!!!!!)
...
that is all
good luck
and good work
sincerely JAMES.

Wow, that's a BIG list Wink , many thanks for the suggestions and compliments 8), I can say we are going to use MANY of those vehicles and weapons in TAOW, you may want to check the following link which shows all our current fully 'Approved' vehicles so far: http://taow.simulationboard.com/member-s-access-f5/the-art-of-war-vehicle-table-t122.htm (please note that you have to be logged in to check it, since it's part of the member's area)
...note that the american faction is practically complete (there will be some unit added 'here and there' later on though), the EU/Russian factions only show the basic (though we have a complete list which will be gradually updated and revealed on that table as new models/vehicles are released to the public, no hard feelings Razz , about ships, these will be revealed when a proper "Navy Mode Update" is presented (till then it's top secret Suspect Smile , though I can confirm that the ships shown in the 'TAOW Documents' topic will be included, eg: the DDG-1000 Zumwalt Class Destroyer).



By the way, the next update is gonna be HUGE ("Mega Update, Part 2"), maybe the biggest and most diverse update TAOW ever had since it's beginning, we will create a new "Poll" so people are able to choose the next generation light weapon that the US military will use (to replace the current M16/M4's), heads up sunny

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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  Tusker2Zero on Wed Nov 26, 2008 1:22 am

I've read that you have C-130's (and possibly C-17's) deploying units via airdrop. I was just wondering if it's possible to code the game where it could do a coastal landings where the AI could drop reinforcements off at a selected coastal point.

High Speed Vessel (HSV)
Theater Support Vessel (TSV) ACTD:

... The TSV gives the theater Commander a high-speed, intra-theater sealift capability to support all theater engagement requirements within his Area of Responsibility (AOR). The TSV will provide the capability to operationally move and maneuver combat ready unit sets from staging sites into the forward areas, and to provide follow-on sustainment, through degraded and minor ports. The TSV will carry 600 short tons of cargo, go 40+ knots and have a fully loaded range of 4,500 nautical miles. The vessel can perform trans-oceanic crossings totally unreplensihed. This technology will transform the Objective Force by providing the capability to rapidly re-position the Interim Brigade Combat Team (IBCT) up to 400 nm (equivalent to 245 C-17 sorties). ...

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ship/hsv.htm

It would be a great way to get a moderately substantial number of reinforcing Marines and/or their vehicles into the theater [map].

Just a thought.
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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  Snake on Wed Nov 26, 2008 9:03 pm

As a matter of fact we were trying to create a "naval counterpart" of air deployment methods for the Naval Mode, but at the fist analysis it's extremely difficult if not impossible to code the AI to act smoothly according to our standards (we are not really sure at the moment, our first priority will be to code LCAC (Landing Craft, Air Cushioned) transports, and from it we may have a much greater chance of succeeding into creating such larger deployment methods).



The LCAC will be the standard US Amphibious Transport (it will deploy land units which in turn are deployed from Assault Ships), but as we know, the LCAC can only transport a very limited attack force (and weight), so we really wanted to include a more capable (higher capacity) transport as well (probably a later deployment in game to avoid initial large scale naval landing forces). The LCAC will be extremely important because once we are 100% done with it (in terms of coding) we will apply many of it's "coding components" to other specific ships.

European and Russian naval forces will have specific naval landing units.

The LCAC will be the very first and earlier alternative for the US Navy for deployment of land units, hopefully we'll be able to include larger transport/deployment ships which will deploy large landing forces. Most of these will most likely be controlled by the player instead of the AI though.

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Idea for US

Post  General Psycho on Tue Dec 23, 2008 3:51 pm

How about the OH-58D Kiowa that would be a perfect recon helicopter

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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  Snake on Tue Dec 23, 2008 3:54 pm


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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  General Psycho on Tue Dec 23, 2008 5:40 pm

Well the Idea of mine came a little bit too late but I searched the whole day Ideas and I posted it in the Vehicle List

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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  Snake on Tue Dec 23, 2008 5:44 pm

Many thanks either way Thumbs Up! , each faction will have recon helicopters, these are able to be armed (lightly armed - via upgrade) and are excellent artillery spotters (so the artillery can fire from safety and hit/destroy the enemy with excellent precision).

As more units are unlocked, the player will have a great possible selection of recon units (ranging from scout infantry to satellites).

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a Russian High Tech Jet

Post  General Psycho on Wed Dec 24, 2008 3:45 am

I found the Mikoyan Porject 1.44 or MIG-MFI

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikoyan_Project_1.44

Its an Stealth Air Superiority Fighter in Development

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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  General Psycho on Wed Dec 24, 2008 3:59 am

Also I think we need the MIG-35

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikoyan_MiG-35


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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

Post  James100 on Wed Dec 24, 2008 10:17 am

but those r Expiremental black aircraft
i think it isn't gonna be included
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Re: Discussion: GamePlay and Units Ideas

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